Carl Dong on VPN Privacy, Relays and Supply Chain Security
October 19, 2026
In this Final Settlement interview from Onramp Media, host Liam Nelson speaks with Carl Dong, founder of Obscura VPN and former Bitcoin Core developer, about VPN privacy, two-party relays and software supply chain security. Onramp publishes the episode as educational content, and Carl's views are his own.
Liam Nelson interviews Carl Dong, founder of Obscura VPN and former Bitcoin Core developer, about his path from the Great Firewall to Blockstream and Chaincode Labs, where his focus was software supply chain security. Carl explains reproducible builds and fuzzing, and describes his view that AI's infinite patience makes theoretical attacks more practical. He outlines how a traditional VPN works and how Obscura's two-party relay with Mullvad is designed to split what each company can see, and he describes disguising VPN traffic as HTTP/3 to work on restrictive networks. Liam and Carl also discuss AI agents and web traffic, connected AI, private and local models, and how recent hardware wallet supply chain security reports bear on the bitcoin industry. Obscura is a third-party product and is discussed as Carl's own project.
Chapters
00:00 - Carl Dong: from the Great Firewall to Bitcoin Core 03:15 - Carl's View on VPN Trust and the Two-Party Relay Idea 06:29 - AI, Patience and Software Supply Chain Security 08:41 - Reproducible builds: verifying Bitcoin Core downloads 11:15 - How a Traditional VPN Works and What It Can See 14:25 - Carl on Trust and Verification in VPNs 15:31 - Beating censorship by looking like normal traffic 18:38 - Mimicking HTTP/3 so VPNs don't get blocked 19:18 - Freedom tech has to be easy to use 22:07 - Carl's View on AI Traffic and the Web 24:59 - AI and Personal Data, and Private AI 29:58 - Local AI models on your phone 30:57 - What's next for Obscura: Linux and automatic protection 32:15 - Hardware Wallet Supply Chain Security and the Bitcoin Industry 34:24 - Where to find Carl and Obscura
Frequently Asked Questions
Who is the guest on this Final Settlement episode?
The guest is Carl Dong, founder of Obscura VPN and a former Bitcoin Core developer who also worked at Blockstream and Chaincode Labs. His background is introduced at 00:00.
What does Carl Dong explain about VPN design?
At 03:15 and 11:15 Carl describes how a traditional VPN works and outlines Obscura's two-party relay with Mullvad, which he says is designed so neither company knows both who you are and where you go.
What is covered about software supply chain security?
At 06:29 and 08:41 Carl discusses supply chain security, reproducible builds and fuzzing, and how he sees AI changing attacker effort. At 32:15 the hosts discuss hardware wallet supply chain security.
What does the episode say about AI and privacy?
From 22:07 to 29:58 Liam and Carl discuss AI agents and web traffic, connected AI that holds personal data, and private and local models. These are the speakers' views, not advice from Onramp.
This episode is editorial and educational content. Onramp does not provide tax, legal, or investment advice. Bitcoin is volatile and may lose value. Past performance does not guarantee future results.